silkfire의 댓글

I thought prot paladins used Seal of Vengeance/Corruption exclusively?

348059의 댓글

For noobs who cant count:

3x 73 = 219

494555의 댓글

Can you say Tower Defense?

48165의 댓글

@tonydizzle:

I disagree, and I certainly won't be buying this libram to replace my Libram of Defiance any time soon.

Yes, it does have 19 more dodge rating once fully stacked. Which is less than 0.5% before diminishing returns (less after). The problem, however, is that it takes a while to fully stack. Starting with no stacks, and casting Shield of Righteousness at t = 0 and every time it's off cooldown, it will be fully stacked in 12 seconds. The old libram can have its buff up at the very first moment (although it's a proc, it's mostly limited by a short internal cooldown, once that cooldown is done the proc chance is very close to 100%).

Why does this matter? Because the stacks will fall off during a fight. Not because of missing procs (obviously), but through fight mechanics on various bosses. And the time when a boss returns to the tank after an idle period is often when we take the biggest health drops, as healers may have been distracted by other aspects of the fight while the tank was not taking damage. And in the worst case, you'll lose the buff in just over 9 seconds (if you're unable to get in a quick last ShoR). And then it takes 12 seconds to build up again.

Practical example is Lord Marrowgar, who spins around charging random raid members for quite some time regularly, and (partially depending on your tactics) will be very difficult to reliably hit during that period. Meaning by the end of that phase you've probably lost the buff. And the moment you pull the boss back to you is just when you need it the most.

I'll grant that on fights where you can guarantee full uptime even through mechanics, this is a slight upgrade. But taking the "slight" part as well as all the above into account, it will certainly be the bottom item on my Emblem of Frost wishlist - emblems which everyone will need tons of for all their gear.

warcanon의 댓글

If you got the iLvl 245 libram you can save yourself 30 marks and try buy something else. The old one is good and imo, there is no dire need to replace it this soon into the patch. some paladin tanks (you are a tank right?) like me don't got all items 245+. I'm going to buy me a cookie until I can get my hands on enough marks to buy anything at all. Have a nice day getting those shiny new marks.
I don't want to promote the old libram too much, just that 30 of the new marks might be alot for the upgrade it is :)
I wish you good luck with your brand new Libram.

badassnewbie의 댓글

Definitely will wait on this one. Whereas the 245 libram was basically the first emblem gear I got last patch, this libram will likely be my last piece of gear for this patch.

48165의 댓글

In addition to my earlier reply (which I somehow managed to not make a reply to tonydizzle's post so it's actually a couple of posts down) this discussion thread on Maintankadin is very relevant here.

For a tl;dr let me just quote a fragment of what Theck, Maintankadin's theorycrafting & numbercrunching guru writes (the "that" at the start refers to some more elaborate reasoning on the risk of the buff falling off during a fight):

That, combined with the fact that

it's only a 19 dodge rating upgrade (what's that, like, 2 ilvls worth of dodge?),
and the fact that it isn't already sitting in my inventory,
and the fact that it will cost badges that could be more readily put towards tier pieces or other, bigger upgrades
and the fact that it takes up an inventory slot
and the fact that unless Icecrown massively overhauls encounter design, avoidance is still a far less important stat than EH

all lead to this libram being way too weak to be worth anything. If it were 300 dodge rating, then maybe we'd talk. At 219, I probably won't even bother picking it up before off-spec ret gear.

48165의 댓글

To reply to the reply to my reply:

In reply to Zyrashana: I never talked about how "worth the Emblems" it might be, so you can't disagree with me. All I am saying is it is definitely an upgrade, no matter how small.

No, it's not definitely an upgrade and I can certainly still disagree with you. "Definitly an upgrade" would be if it had the exact same mechanic and proc rate/chance but with higher dodge rating. It doesn't. It's a different mechanic, and the libram is better in some situations and worse in others. Higher total dodge after giving it the chance & time to stack up, but slower buildup which can be a downside.

iMathias의 댓글

For what it's worth... stats might be bad... but it has a nice icon...

SPF18의 댓글

Meh, it could certainly use an boost, and hopefully it'll get one.

In the mean time, it'll be my last or second to last thing I get. And I agree...it does have a cool name and Icon. Now if only our Librams showed -_-

531498의 댓글

and the fact that unless Icecrown massively overhauls encounter design, avoidance is still a far less important stat than EH

So...do you see a libram out there somewhere w/ some +stam on it? I sure don't...

This is unquestionably an upgrade over the i245 libram. However, should it be the first piece of gear that you get w/ your frost emblems? Probably not.

What I'm more interested in finding out is whether or not the procs from this libram could stack w/ the proc from the i245 libram by way of in-combat libram swapping.

ThunderSithy의 댓글

How about we get a libram that looks more like THIS one day...
Just got this today, FYI last piece of frost emblem kit I just got before I start grabbing saronites for crafts

arbdrone의 댓글

According to Zyrashana's post;

I've noticed with the addon gearscore, alot of players invest in items due to Item Level, not always the best to do. So I did math based off of Zyrashana's information. Assuming that it takes 12 seconds to reach 3 stacks:

6 secs of the uptime has 73 dodge per second = 438 dodge total
6secs of the uptime has 146 dodge (2 stacks) = 876 dodge total
6secs of the uptime has 219 dodge (3stacks) = 1314 dodge total

Adding up total per second dodge that is gained over 18seconds, gives a total of 2628 dodge, divided by the total uptime of 18secs, grants about 146dodge per second.

The 245 Libram of Defiance, broken down to the same math:
6secs of the uptime of 200dodge = 1200 dodge
6secs of the uptime of 200dodge = 1200 dodge
6secs of the uptime of 200dodge = 1200 dodge

3600 dodge over 18secs, is 200 dodge per second (math here was a waste, but still broken down into it). That's 54 more dodge over the entire uptime of the Libram of Defiance.

Please note, I used a DPS equation to determine the uptime in per second figures. It's realy the only way i know how to >.>

606434의 댓글

I think this libram isn't worth considering unless it is the only thing you can buy from frosties that is an upgrade.
Untill then don't take it, also don't think it's better gs so it's worth buying it or something like that, the 24 gs and the 19 dodge is defenitley not worth spending frosties on when still needing other gear from it. I suggest 2 all newcomig tanks 2 buy Libram of Defiance.

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